Sue Higham (PAYE, SA, NIC Process - MPPC) Chair
Tim Downes (IMS Portfolios web solutions)
Pam Jones (IMS Portfolios)
Nicky Prys-Jones (BCU Carter Programme)
Simon Lidster (PAYE - MPPC)
Sue Manley (PAYE - MPPC)
Jen Morgan (PAYE - MPPC)
Neil Stenton (PAYE - MPPC) Secretary and minutes
Chris Hind - British Chamber of Commerce Norman Green - British Computer
Society
Matthew Brown - Chartered Institute of Taxation
Elaine Gibson - Institute of Payroll Professionals
Marcia Bowen - Payroll Alliance
Diana Flier - Business Application Software Developers Association
Maria Hennessey - Electronic Exchange User Group
The Consultative Forum Chair opened the meeting at 10.35 with apologies from Carolyn Parmeter BCU Carter Programme, Ken Voller from Institute of Chartered Accountants in England and Wales, and Jackie Petherbridge from Public Sector Payroll Group and Federation of Small Businesses.
Following a review of, and update to, the action points from the previous meetings the minutes from the last meeting were agreed.
HMRC advised that it was aware of benefits to both itself and customers of the facility to test online submissions. HMRC asked ES if they thought that the facility to do this for in-year forms would be of benefit from April 2009 or not. ES believed that the risks for allowing this facility were initially minimal but suggested that if the facility proved to be creating problems HMRC could consider removing it later. HMRC thanked ES for their comments and agreed to forward this suggestion to the Software Developers Support Team.
HMRC acknowledged there had been problems in developing the new P45 stationery but confirmed the technical specification for the online P45 had been published on 17 October 2008, this had been in relation to the queries raised on the font sizes suggested. HMRC advised that it had been asked by software developers to align the boxes on all the P45 stationery and with this in mind a fourth and final technical specification will be published in December 2008. Online P45 forms produced with either the October or December specification will be accepted by HMRC up to and including 5 April 2009. The December specification must be used for any forms submitted from 6 April 2009 onwards. There are, and have been, no problems with the P45 manual version.
HMRC advised that the continuous and laser sheet version of the P45 forms had been amended and tested and orders could now be placed with the employer orderline - delivery of the new forms is expected to take place mid December 2008. ES were advised that stationery would be issued with a bespoke letter in each box identifying how the stationery had been packed.
HMRC apologised for the delay in making these forms available and any problems this had caused software developers. HMRC thanked members of ES for testing the new stationery and providing valuable feedback, and points to note, for future development of forms. HMRC advised all points had been noted and passed to the relevant teams for information and reference.
HMRC advised that MPPC had recently been through a re-planning exercise and was now working to deliver Release 3 of the new PAYE service to the department in the summer of 2009. Indications showed that this would be followed by an update in October 2009 in relation to annual coding and then a final update, Release 4, in April 2010. HMRC advised that they were moving to deliver the new service with confidence and were awaiting approval of the date. The new PAYE service would be rolled out to staff in stages.
HMRC advised that the processing of the date of birth and gender information from in-year starter forms was originally based on the new PAYE service going live in October 2008, this data would then have been processed, and used for tracing and matching purposes, from April 2009. However, as the new service is not likely to go live until after April 2009 (when the date of birth and gender details become mandatory fields for completion) the data will still be taken, but not processed. HMRC believed that this should not cause employers any problems and that as and when the new PAYE goes live, employers should see a reduction in the amount of contact they receive from HMRC asking for additional information to trace/match records. The date of birth and gender information will be the key for maintaining accuracy of customers records.
ES asked if the move to the new PAYE service, which may clash with the period of P11D submission, would affect the submission of P11Ds and HMRC advised it would not. HMRC said these forms would be captured and stored before flowing across to the new service. The HMRC Online Return and Forms - PAYE service would not close during the cross over from COP to the new PAYE system and it would be business as usual for employers during this period. Members of ES advised they were monitoring employee queries to gauge the problems likely to be raised during the cross over in order to assist HMRC in planning any communications messages. HMRC advised it was reviewing its contact centre strategy for telephone queries and also looking at the processing of customer postal queries.
HMRC advised that plans were already in place to review communications for the PAYE service go live next year and also for the period when HMRC may be restricted in the customer service it would be able to provide during the cross over from COP.
HMRC passed on thanks to all members of ES for their assistance in reviewing and formulating communications messages to its customers, not only during the course of the meetings but also during additional telephone conferences. HMRC advised that the input of ES was both welcome and valued.
ES were asked if they believed an additional message, to promote the success and advantages of the re-launched Online Return and Forms - PAYE service in October 2008, would be beneficial. It was agreed that as a similar message already existed, on the HMRC web pages, which covered this, there was no need for a further communication.
HMRC advised that following a recent MPPC re-structure and re-concentration of resources, todays meeting would be the last for this particular sub group. All future MPPC and Carter issues would be covered and addressed at the main Employment Consultation Forum. HMRC thanked all members of the group for their assistance and support at the meetings over the years to discuss MPPC and Carter issues. HMRC advised that there would still be the need to seek advice and opinions on future communications issues and that the group would still receive updates. In particular HMRC would like to thank the Federation of Small Businesses for their assistance in providing feedback on testing sessions they had participated in.
ES in turn thanked HMRC for their openness and help over the years the meetings had been held.
HMRC advised that the minutes from the meeting of 10 September 2008 will be published shortly on its web pages and minutes from todays meeting will be circulated for agreement as soon as possible.
Forum ended at 11.45.
Action points from previous meetings
